tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post2034620135388506177..comments2024-03-28T16:21:30.329-04:00Comments on Patricia Abbott (pattinase): What Constitutes a Classic in Crime Fiction? pattinase (abbott)http://www.blogger.com/profile/02916037185235335846noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-55373939167658796022016-03-24T07:51:35.589-04:002016-03-24T07:51:35.589-04:00That's a hard question, Patti. To me, both Elm...That's a hard question, Patti. To me, both Elmore Leonard and Agatha Christie count as authors of classic crime fiction. But they're really of course quite different. I think it has to do with the enduring quality of their work.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-1277999007273754082016-03-23T18:43:42.699-04:002016-03-23T18:43:42.699-04:00I guess I will somewhat disagree. I would eliminat...I guess I will somewhat disagree. I would eliminate the last thirty years perhaps from consideration but would put JACK RETURNS HOME (GET CARTER) in 1970 as a classic. Also EDDIE COYLE'S FRIENDS (Higgins), some of Elmore Leonard, Derek Raymond's Factory series and others. I think it's age but also a book that is especially well-written, or does something new or especially originally. pattinase (abbott)https://www.blogger.com/profile/02916037185235335846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-28001328487348096442016-03-23T18:20:47.929-04:002016-03-23T18:20:47.929-04:00I can't help but think of classic equating wit...I can't help but think of classic equating with age. Whether it's classic rock, classic literature, or classic crime fiction none of it can be called contemporary, IMO. For me classic crime fiction is always going to include the older books of the 30s 40s and 50s with maybe a nudge into the early 1960s.J F Norrishttp://prettysinister.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-67986008200272085332016-03-23T16:37:19.171-04:002016-03-23T16:37:19.171-04:00I would say individual works. Coming immediately t...I would say individual works. Coming immediately to mind for me are <i>The Maltese Falcon</i> and <i>The Big Sleep</i>. Then again, thinking author, coming to mind immediately for me is Arthur Conan Doyle. Mathew Pausthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06157135006791553019noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-37484171549344007042016-03-23T14:04:05.168-04:002016-03-23T14:04:05.168-04:00Oops. Thanks, Graham. I'll be here all week. P...Oops. Thanks, Graham. I'll be here all week. Please remember to tip your waitress...Dana Kinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01350344882342624735noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-30773826209867697602016-03-23T14:00:33.520-04:002016-03-23T14:00:33.520-04:00Dana, your rather excellent typo in your comment m...Dana, your rather excellent typo in your comment makes me want to see what the Coen brothers could do with The Maltese Falcon. They already basically did The Glass Key.Graham Powellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01775285782385634486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-42287498655781032872016-03-23T13:29:05.458-04:002016-03-23T13:29:05.458-04:00Depends on whether we're using "classic&q...Depends on whether we're using "classic" as an adjective or a noun. "Classical" music has come to mean more than music written in the Classical period. If we mean "classic" to refer to the period, then we're looking at Christie and her peers. The other definition of "classic" (serving as a standard of excellence : of recognized value) then THE MALTESE FALCOEN, THE LONG GOOD-BYE, etc. have to be included.Dana Kinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01350344882342624735noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-45425637578323391362016-03-23T13:26:05.795-04:002016-03-23T13:26:05.795-04:00My first definition of "classic" is gold...My first definition of "classic" is golden age, and I think that's a good definition. Mostly British authors. There are also classics in other mystery genres; Hammett and Chandler wrote some classic hard-boiled mysteries, for instance, and there are some cozy classics by American authors as well as thriller, spy, legal, etc. But I have a hard time with new or newer books being "classic", and I don't believe there can be such a thing as "an instant classic".Rick Robinsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07978136287154214297noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-28665119763833318162016-03-23T12:44:35.953-04:002016-03-23T12:44:35.953-04:00There is a logical reason for thinking of older bo...There is a logical reason for thinking of older books as classics: they've lasted, which means they have some valuable quality.<br />The interesting distinction is between classics <b>in</b> crime fiction and works of crime fiction which are classics - the ones that cross over from genre. Roger Allenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11012987757094423896noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-79905498721763212882016-03-23T10:59:09.311-04:002016-03-23T10:59:09.311-04:00I guess when I think classics I think older stuff,...I guess when I think classics I think older stuff, Christie, etc. But there isn't any logical reason for that.Charles Gramlichhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02052592247572253641noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-12237481151326898492016-03-23T09:49:33.200-04:002016-03-23T09:49:33.200-04:00When I think classic "mystery" writers I...When I think classic "mystery" writers I do think more Golden Age. Leonard is a crime writer but for the most part there isn't the "whodunit" element of the earlier books.Jeff Meyersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00093411926030586355noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-5119164677490520822016-03-23T08:59:53.113-04:002016-03-23T08:59:53.113-04:00Interesting distinction, Graham. It dates to a pos...Interesting distinction, Graham. It dates to a post where I asked what classic crime writers haven't your read. But as you point out, classic works can be produced by writers whose main body of work may not be classic. <br />So for today's purpose what constitutes classic in crime writers?pattinase (abbott)https://www.blogger.com/profile/02916037185235335846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33110302.post-28988285693309383262016-03-23T08:57:20.955-04:002016-03-23T08:57:20.955-04:00Are we talking about authors or particular works? ...Are we talking about authors or particular works? I think that you can call either one a classic but the criteria would be different. For an author, they'd have to stand above their contemporaries in some way. Their books would have to be widely acknowledged as being "better".<br /><br />But for an individual book, even unremarkable authors can write classic books - either superior examples of their form, or ground-breaking originals. My own example would be Joel Townsley Rogers, a good but not great author who with THE RED RIGHT HAND produced a classic of the ultra-paranoid mystery.Graham Powellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01775285782385634486noreply@blogger.com